Dear Jolla followers and especially Jolla Tablet contributors and pre-order customers,
It has been a while since I, as the captain of the Jolla boat, have written anything here on the Jolla Blog. Now I’d like to share some news from our start-up’s helm.
As you all know, Jolla is a small boat (= start-up in layman’s terms), which is fighting through the stormy waters carrying a huge cargo: Sailfish OS – one of the few independent mobile operating systems – and, of course, the Jolla smartphone and Jolla Tablet. To an outsider it may appear as if we are “just” carrying devices and tablets, but it is actually the operating system that is taking up the most space and requires a lot of development and effort.
Typically only huge “cargo ships” like Google (Android) and Apple (iOS) carry operating systems as cargo. No wonder our sailors (Jolla employees) sometimes feel that this is “mission impossible”, yet they keep on delivering. We just successfully delivered Sailfish OS 2.0 – the new, fresh version of the Sailfish operating system. Now this beautiful OS has been delivered to our current Jolla smartphone users and it will also be shipping with the new Jolla tablets.
Where is the Jolla Tablet?
While Sailfish OS 2.0 was delivered successfully, we have not succeeded in delivering the Jolla Tablet on time to our Indiegogo contributors, and we will miss the schedule for our pre-order customers, too. We have faced numerous challenges, ranging from issues with component deliveries, to component issues with the display (we’ve kept you up to date with all the challenges we’ve faced with the display), to securing manufacturing time slots from the factory. All these put together have contributed to a domino effect, negatively impacting assembly and shipment timeline of the Jolla Tablet.
On behalf of my team and myself, I would like to apologize for this. This is not a formal apology on paper – this is a deep, sincere apology combined with a Japanese style bow with my forehead touching the floor.
There are many reasons for these unexpected delays, but rather than provide you with more justification – as valid as it may be – we instead wish to share with you our current Jolla Tablet delivery roadmap.
The good news is that we are shipping the first batch of the tablets now. At the same time we are preparing the second batch and aim to start shipping at the beginning of November. Finally, and assuming all goes well, we aim to start shipping the remaining of the Jolla Tablets during December 2015.
Now I expect that those who pre-ordered the Jolla Tablet during August-September 2015 are asking “what about my tablet?” Well, we will certainly ship yours too, but only after fulfilling our early Indiegogo backers contributions. According to the current plan, this will also happen during December 2015.
We understand that some of you may wish to opt out from the Jolla Tablet project. Therefore, we are looking into a refund option. More info will be shared about this later, and please bear with us as we will only be able to handle such cases after we have shipped all the tablets.
I want to again personally apologize for the inconvenience and frustration this has caused. More than that, I want to thank you for your contribution to this project, without which we honestly would not have been able to get here. My personal, heartfelt plea is for your continued support and patience.
We will get there, of that I am sure. Together.
Your Jolla captain,
Antti
Thanks for update, and sorry you needed to share news like this. How big is this 2nd batch expected to be?
To make this a bit more valuable question: How does the waves in the image go together with the stages on the Indiegogo campaign?
No answer? Should we take it as the first hour contributors might see their tablets shipping tomorrow, or by the end of December (assuming the 2nd batch has similar size with the 1st)? This would really be a worthfull answer, in the name of transparency, please
I’m in the first wave, according to the date and time I pre-ordered but I’ve not received the link to finalize the shipping and stuff. So I’m not sure what they pursue as ‘first wave’ then…
Read it as shippent begun but we will have major delays. Think that image is crap and not anything releatedto reallity . Im pretty sure jolla will have to do many more wave 10-20? rather than 3. Excpect delays !
If you want this answered we are going to have to figure it out ourselves. Each time a person posts that they got it we should ask when then joined indiegogo.
mosen has done a great job
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1qS0DE4oOf7qPYjwUAaL-rjoPcqu6hHQRJOdspQ4_Hgc/edit#gid=0
Ahh now that is what I prefer, I just hope it is updated on a regular basis or at least then abstracted to a status bar or something.
Good job!
Its update when you inform mosen. Head over to TMO and inform him about your status.
You can post here: https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1485013#post1485013
Ok .. well not a member of that forum yet so I’ll sign up and let them know when it arrives.
Cheers
hi just see your wonderful copilation. just want o know one thing from where i can see order number. i ordered one tab 20 Nov 2015.regards
This would be gold to get an answer for.
As a “First Sailor” backer (the perk was named as ‘Jolla Tablet for First Sailors’ on IndieGoGo) I’d like to know when I should be expecting my tablet to arrive…
Sadly, due to all these delays (which I don’t blame the Jolla crew for) I’ve bought an iPad Mini 3 to take place as my current to-go tablet, which works quite well for my needs at the moment.
So the refund option mentioned in this blog post has also become a considerable option, although it will be dealt with after all the tablets have been delivered first…
Think about a head of a company showing one like that in a partner negotiation, another party then asking for some clearance. Then think about why the image is there – it seems to try to share some kind of a schedule. Silence on this situation would lack some respect.
This is pretty disappointing actually. I was hoping shipping the tablets to the backers wouldn’t take until Christmas.
I guess my tablet will land on eBay, then. Having 7 months less in this tablets lifecycle, makes me want to get something more recently released.
inb4: Indiegogo is not Amazon
Can you sell me your order? I will pay the full price for the tablet. If you are interested please send an e-mail to jakibaki (at) live (dot) com
Hello, thanks for the update 🙂
Does the “Final wave” include also the ones from August-September 2015 or the schedule in the image is strictly related to the Indiegogo phase?
Hi g7, yes it includes the ones from Aug-Sept 2015 pre-orders. “According to the current plan, this will also happen during December 2015.”
That’s great! Thank you very much for confirming.
Hi Carol. That is indeed good news. I’m a March contributor, so does that make me 2nd or third wave?
Many Thanks
Ian
What does it mean exactly? I ordered tablet to my office – being there more than not during working days – but planned to take vacations from mid of December…
Carol will you please answer the many people who have asked how many people are included in each wave? It seems you are intentionally not answering these people, if you want to leave that impression with us, you are doing an extremely good job. Please provide specifics as to the illustrated but potentially fictional
‘waves’
Thanks a lot for this update and certainly I’ll not leave the boat (refund otion) at this point!
However, the new schedule is not very detailed. What exactly do you mean by first, second, and final wave? Does this correspond to contributions in last November, December, and later? Or what is the swell of these waves (how many devices in each)?
All the best and keep on blogging!
if in the current shipment there aren’t problems in the second wave they will ship many more tablet. I ordered on 6 december so I hope to be included in the second wave!
Hello, thanks for the update
i’m from Russia and contribute tablet at November 19
Prompt when sending to expect , since Russia is specified separate delivery.
*google translate
Thank you for being so upfront with the update. In practical terms, what does this mean for those of us who took part in the Indiegogo campaign in mid-November of last year? I did not get an invite for the first wave, and I know I’m one of the earliest purchasers.
Thanks!
Thanks 😉 If some one will opt out, can I order one more tablet?
Thank you for the update! Roadblocks are a fact of life, actually for businesses both large and small. 🙂 But I’m glad to hear that you’ve rolled with the punches and are still in the game; that’s what it takes to succeed in the end. I’ll hang on for my tablet to arrive… 🙂
Thanks for the info!
Will continue to cruise with you guys in my even smaller jolla-tender! 🙂
+1 🙂
*Removed by request of comment author*
+1, what is waves?
+2, How do we determine which in wave is my contribution?
However, thanks for this update. I do understand that it must not be easy to coordinate everything.
On the other hand I must say that this article could have been written a couple days earlier. That would have minimized the bad vibrations that have kept appearing in the blog/forum.
I suspect they wanted to wait until the first wave of tablets actually started shipping (which indeed they now have). And honestly, that isn’t such a bad plan; at least it shows that the first item in the new schedule is proceeding as scheduled…
It seems that they waited until the first ones started arriving at their destinations. I have seen tweets from people who’ve received theirs already. So I agree with Lupastro. They could’ve shared this information a few days earlier.
That said, I do want to thank Antti for the update, nevertheless.
I hope I don’t have to wait until end of december for my tablet. As it’s unclear to me when they are going to send out the orders from the second Indiegogo fundraiser from early 2015.
first of all…congrats to enter the tablet market with your first tablets.
secondary…great with a refund option without receving tablet would be
the right thing to do.
third…thank you for the blog post/update
Thank you for the update! A clear and open story.
As an early Indiegogo contributor – this is all I’ve been waiting for! Just talk to us.
We all are able to understand the hard challenges you’re going through. But if you don’t talk to us – how should we understand?
I hope to get my 3 preordered Tablet until christmas. 🙂
Hold on, be strong, ’cause only strong sailors will survive the storm!
+1
Thumbs up, jolla & Antti !
No doubt Sailfish must remain a ( sorry: “the” 😉 ) choice of independence, privacy & security on this planet !
Never give it up ! All my support guaranteed ! 🙂
… btw what happened to the jolla split-up ?
Is jollaHW up to facing a real future ?
Haven’t heard much of it since the press release this summer …
… after a significant person like Marc has left all too silently the boat apart a supportive community which deserved a statement though – is Carol aka cybette still onboard ?
I highly admired the work of those people both in development and community work respectively …
See a bit further up in this discussion, Carol is very much still here!
… oh wow, yes indeed 🙂 !
Actually a bit of the story about the restructuring of jolla could help to not depend on so many guesses only 😉 …
Hi launchpad, I’m still here, thanks for asking! I did take a little break last month (much needed “summer” vacation) but I’m back in full bunny power!
😀 … well glad to hear that: what a way to show commitment 🙂 … bunny power definitely sounds more convincing than bunny stress 😉
Maybe the captain will tell us a bit more about the spin-off / restructuring one of these as well ….
Thanks.
Bunny ?
Is Jolla’s boat the revival of Noah’s Ark ?
😉
thank you very much for this update. send you best wishes everything will go smooth from now on and, no matter for being late. 🙂
Thanks a lot for your update!
The rumours and conjecture that jolla has burnt the money and we would never see tablets shipping which were floating around the internet seem to be baseless 🙂
I am very excited to hold the tablet in my hands and finally sell my last apple-product 😉
Could you please clarify a bit what you mean by first and second wave? Are the contributors which have invitations now the first wave, the ones who got perk x or perk y second? I understand that you don’t want to give us a definite date anymore 😉 But I would appreciate a little bit more
Keep on sailing 🙂
@dalas.revo It seems that the “1st wave” in terms of shipping does not even include all the people who got their invitations on Sept. 22nd. There are a lot of reports on talk.maemo.org from people who got these invitation mails, completed the order(s) but are still waiting for some indication that their order is handled. So while chart leads to the assumption that there are three waves that are more or less equal (in terms of “numbers of tablets shipped”), the truth seems to be that the 1st wave consists only of a few dozen hand-picked devices. Maybe test tablets originally intended for the press, maybe leftovers from a pre-production run, maybe just a very small production run.
The pattern that is most likely at the moment is that only 64MB-devices were shipped. That would mean that only if you got an invitation mail on Sept. 22nd *and* ordered the 64MB version, you are in the first batch.
I myself received “the mail” (and completed my order) on Sept. 22nd, but haven’t got any notification so far that the order is processed. Status in the Jolla Shop is still “paid”. So my assumption is that either the whole ordering system is completely broken and the database simply deleted some orders or that the 1st shipping batch was *not* meant to include all the contributors who have invitations. I prefer to believe in answer #2. 🙂
Before I get this new software versio 1.1.9.28 I am more patient….it is worth to wait. Keep up the good work.
We stand by You…even its painful waiting time.
Well, finally 🙂 And it wasn’t so hard was it.
I have no problems waiting until December. But the silence was just silly.
More updates please. As many as you can.
Maybe not the right place to ask, otherwise I don’t know a better one:
What happened to the Intex Aqua Fish running Sailfish OS 2.0? Is that one also delayed or could we expect a launch next month?
Intex did not intend to actually launch a Jolla-based device until at least the end of the year. So no delay. 🙂 Here’s a link to their press release:
http://www.intex.in/Administration/Resources/BlogRecources/20150716013858.pdf
We are working closely with Intex on bringing Sailfish OS 2.0 to their products, and they’ll communicate on the device launch schedule.
This is a fine response. Very informative. However, we do not know how many people are included in each “wave”. Can we get clarity on this very fact please?
Knowing in August and September that it was already past the deadline and not near shipping, it now seems irresponsible to offer to pre-sell more tablets.
It’s nice to see the shipping schedule! With some numbers (when the first thousand ships, when the second ships etc.) it would be even better.
But what about contributors from Russia, when exactly will we get the tablet?
I took the “first sailors” perk. When will I receive the tablet?
This question actually for me too, but i’m from “early sailors”.
I have asked this question several times on twitter and in the previous “and we’re sailing” post, but never got an answer.
I have asked this question too.
no answer.
Maybe they don’t know? 😀 Or the number is so small that they don’t like to say it out loud. Can this be money problem? (no money no tablets from the factory)
Maybe. And maybe not, I’m saw a lot of people from Russia in comments to this blog. It will be interesting to see statistic preorders by countries.
I’m among first contributors and wonder about that too…
I guess they don’t know yet. Most likely they were going to distribute in Russia via n-store, but that’s not that easy. First they need to reach some agreement with n-store and offer something in return for complicated logistics. It’s not that interesting for a mass retailer to deliver 1000 different packages for 20$ each, and delivery priced was already fixed in compaign. Then most likely tablets must be sent here in one batch (ignoring contribution order of course) and go through customs. Since they are sent to an organization, there should be some import tax. Or maybe it could be evaded since personal import for personal use isn’t subjected to tax under most conditions. I’d actually prefer not to pay another 20-30$ that I don’t have to pay by law.
So why go through all that trouble and don’t just mail it via DHL? I don’t know… Maybe they signed a broad exclusive agreement and just can’t.
I’ll be very glad to hear comments on this from Jolla officials.
“We will keep our faith inside our souls”
Stratovarius – Forever Free https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsW0FHJ6jrg
This is not very impressive for pre-orders.
Your company *knowingly* took money and made a contract to deliver a product, indicating this was likely to be “end of October”.
You must have known ***at the time*** that you would not do this.
I understand that you have to fulfill pledges first (and indeed I support that).
But if you didn’t *mean* October for pre-orders, you should not have *said* October for pre-orders.
Ah well I’m going to be honest. It’s extremely disappointing. The tablet will be out of date by the time I get my invite. Well as long as it Comes. I don’t know if I keep it or sell it. It’s been so slow I’ve lost heart a bit.
You’re right. MWC 2015 best tablet will be delivered in 2016 (may be), but rest of the world will be …
Finally a real update. That’s how it should be. Even though i don’t expect answers in this comments threat either, i’d be a lot interested in when the early 2015 backers will receive their tablets. We probably won’t get them until december, will we?
But maybe, if someone from Jolla reads this, may be you can gain some knowledge and experience from it. I backed the project in February 2015 and of course did not expect to see the device in July, even though the indiegogo page claimed delivery might start in July. When it then became August and then September, it was kind of a disappointment but it also made me feel even more excited about the product. Now, still, no one has the device in their hands.
There are no other words than that i am deeply disappointed about the communication of “people powered” Jolla and Sailfish OS.
I know, it’s a small ship and i know your mission is really really hard, especially competing with tremendously huge companies like google, apple and co. What you are providing is an amazing opportunity for people like me, that would like to “opt out” of the dependency of big companies, forcing the people to use their products but not having to “opt out” of contemporary technology. It would probably not make me feel a lot happier if i knew why the delays happened but at least i would have something more to read than vague estimations of users in the comment sections and fights over how anyone should talk and what they should and should not expect.
Also, the promotion of a “preorder batch” before any indiegogo backer was paid its perk with “estimated delivery in october or november” as well as the appearance of the aigo x86 here in the comment sections plus the resignation of Marc Dillon really did make me feel massively mislead by your promises.
Now don’t get me wrong:
PLEASE stick to your mission! We need privacy aware customers, we need technology oriented developers, we NEED alternatives! A Wayland DE for tablets, an Android runtime environment with the independence from Google, and so much more….. It just seems too good to be true! And i’m still merry as a lark to hopefully be able to get the wonderful device in my hands _ASAP_!! And i’m not wandering around here yelling “i hope you can make this up” or “i won’t ever support jolla again” or “what am i supposed to do with obsolete technology”, “X months less in the tablets lifecycle”, …. but i’m just saying: When i backed the project i told all my friends about it – i even was kinda bragging about my soon-to-come beautiful and indie device. Now they make fun at me. That’s no good advertisement for you (and i’m sorry for you about that..) i guess, that, for example
(1) a few more comments on how and why the delay has happened (and has happened to be that long),
(2) something that keeps up the tension, a hands on vide, more pictures, more promising apps, ….
(3) making us backers keep the feeling that we receive an exclusive product (keywords pre-order batch, Aigo x86) and/or
(4) just soooome kind of compensation, even if it is only a display protection foil or some kind of voucher or anything,
wouldn’t have made the impact of the delay for your image as serious as it is now.
Now for the good words:
I am (still) really looking forward to receiving my people powered, open, hightech, indie software, low priced, beautiful Jolla tablet and give my Lastu case a different purpose than collecting dust in the shelf and i REALLY hope that your company can shake off all the side effects of the hard work on the tablet and afterwards provide us for years with amazing software for a hopefully amazing mobile OS 🙂
keep sailing around severe weathers and friendly greetings from a future sailor!
P.S.: can’t you just skip a few orders from December and January and just proceed to the February indiegogo orders??? 😛
+1
+1
+1
Good news, I guess. At least now we have some sort of idea, where we are sailing. It’s a bit sad how this whole tablet episode has gone. Year ago, I was in belief that Jolla and Sailfish will grow to something big and great. I contributed to IGG-project even though I think tablet-PCs are the most useless pieces of technology. Now after the delays, after vague excuses, after more delays, after long silence, I feel that Transparency, Respect, Love & Passion are just buzzwords with no true effect in Jolla’s corporate culture.
Much of the anger and frustration of the community could have been avoided with small daily tweets like “small hickups at the factory” or “problem with screen, may affect schedule”. Something that would have kept contributors aware of what the situation is. Delays and bugs happen, but they can be forgiven IF you keep contributors/community/customers aware of them. Silence is deadly in this case.
So I really hope Jolla will iterate this whole episode and next time communicate a bit better. Silence makes everybody think that you don’t care as long as you get the money.
My feeling is that if something is going to be delayed, it’s better to spend couple of hours to inform the community about this (especially in case of crowdfunded projects) even if it makes that thing to be delayed couple of hours or a day more.
+1 This is exactly what I am thinking too. Jolla should really consider to contact an expensive external consultant after the tablets are delivered to evaluate their communication and learn from the report they make.
@Jolla: I hope you are taking this opportunity of the delays to fix as many bugs in the software as you can. If Jolla supporters receive a tablet with software that runs rock stable for years, this may change their bad feelings.
Although it is disappointing to hear about another delay again, this is better news than no news at all. Let’s hope that everything goes well from now on.
Thank you Jolla for finally providing something more useful than vague assurances. However, even this Blog lacks the sort of detail that I’d like to see.
I know you’re a small and possibly struggling company. That’s the reason you need to differentiate yourselves from the others by communicating more, more often with your customers\supporters.
As you’ll have seen from most of the preceding comments, even your harshest critics, myself included, become calmer, and more understanding when you take ownership of the problems, and tell us what’s going on.
You’ve done the hard bit, which is admitting yet another delay. Please can you now move forward by being much more transparent & informative about continuing progress?
I too would like more detail on these “waves”, who’s likely to be in them (based on date\time of initial acceptance by Indiegogo) , and their likely timing.
Thanks, and keep talking to us.
Finally an update, to break the long silence. Better news is the option for refund.
Thank you for an update! Making software art frustrates.
This is awful! I ordered 19.11.2014 and the tablet is coming maybe in November 2015! This will be the last time that I will buy Jolla devices.
Lakebear, you did not order a Jolla tablet. You did not buy a Jolla device. What you did on 19.11.2014 was *investing* money. You are investing money because you are promised a return. With most investments, the return you are promised is monetary, meaning you get more money back than you invested. With Indiegogo investments the return is not monetary but physical. You are *promised* a perk.
So, Jolla promised to deliver you a tablet on a specific date as the return on your investment. They failed to do that. So, this means we hopefully will receive a tablet later that is economically decreased in value. If Jolla still goes bankrupt, your money will be lost and you do not get the tablet, even if all tablets are produced! If that would happen (I hope not), a liquidator will sell all those tablets to pay employees, taxes, suppliers, and we will not get anything.
If you feel cheated by Jolla, there is no way to sue Jolla. Ok, I admit you can, but the chance you win is 0%. You only can try to sue Indiegogo if you have convincing arguments that Indiegogo not made clear to you that you were investing and that you thought you were buying something. Chances that you will win also will be low as I read all and it was clear to me I was not buying anything. If you visit a bank to buy shares for 10,000 EUR/USD and the bank clerk starts to talk about the risks and you tell him to skip that part and sign the contract without reading, then it is your decision to be uniformed about the risks.
PS: I agree with you and most other people here that Jolla failed in their communication.
+1
Kiitos for communicating, Antti. My family is waiting for one of the tablets. Will refunds result in the possibility for us to buy another tablet? If so then when will that possibility open?
What the hell? As an engineering co. I would expect more precise answer. Numbers, dates estimation… this is some kind of joke, not a detailed post. This PM’s drawing (it is not a figure, etc.) shows nothing. Fading squares? – realy? Appologies are on place, but from this point I still know nothing about shipment of tablet I ordered. Wow, you are not like big players like Google or Apple but you behave like them. Change your quote from UNLIKE, to just LIKE others. Good job.
I agree!
+1
If the second wave is as big as the first (the size of the rectangles are the same), you know you will not get before january…
+1 I’m afraid so. Those to identical in diameter rectangles gives this conclusion, good point raron. So next wave will be same 200pcs. From 22nd September till (precisely saying) some gray point of November they will suceed to send summary 400pcs. Realy great job! I will remind that estimated date was MAY 2015 and as far I remeber it was more than 400pcs. 🙂 This will be my good example how to kill the business. Do you even remeber why you left Nokia? Now I see no reason.
Maybe the may 2015 was a mistake, and the correct date is may 2016 😉
While I would pick some softer tone, I had the same impression of just another promo talk (lack of details). I know dealing with XXL projects is hard work, BUT the lack of communication is IMHO more worse then the delay of months (which can happen even with best practise workflows).
+1
All sailors; be proud to be a member of our small community. our friends are working hard. and it is fast going to be christmas.
Yeah, Sailors don’t whine. When there’s no wind, there’s no wind. After storm it might be calm, after calm another storm.. Let’s hold on to the great spirit!
«Let’s hold on to the great spirit!» Do not tell this to us, say this to the Jolla co. it is them, that were silent with longer and longer delays, and anouce another delay. I was quiet for long time, but even for me it is too much. I will repeat myselfe, do not promisse somthing that you cannot keep it. Or you are serious player or you are like 90% of indiegogo, startup etc. projects.
You seem to be quite right…
How do we find out what batch we’re in?
Give us some clue. I’ve asked via zendesk and that was a total waste of time.
Next step is practice your customer service skills as the are lacking.
All I want is transparency and honesty not give me the bullshit runaround as you lost my respect.
I asked via Zendesk as well; same result. Just the default answer to wait for the email.
This blog post is really too late and by far not detailed, or as Jolla loves to say, OPEN enough.
Ok, on one hand, I’m not bothered so much about when the Tablet will arrive, if it’s in 2015, that’s fine with me, but, and that’s a big BUT, tell me. If I ask you at which position in the queue I am, tell me. I can’t find anything about it on Indiegogo, so I asked via Zendesk and effectively: no answer (but the default one).
It’s clear from many comments here, that’s what is frustrating backers most. Most people were well aware that backing is an investment, with a risk; many of them were not surprised that the initial release date was too ambitious. Most of them felt ”sorry’ for Jolla and stayed supportive, I think most of them still are. For me, yes me too. I still like what Jolla is trying to accomplish. BUT, again a big one, I agree with cicorias, the company is losing my respect by the way it is communcating. Communcation is not open and not on time. This will stop me from backing another campaign by Jolla if there is one to come. And that’s a pity! It’s not the engineers that are responsible for this; it’s management and communication.
So Antti, take an honest look at the schedule you added to this post and ask yourself how much information you really are providing with this graph and compare it to the questions asked and the data found on many Jolla related blogs etc. (which I think most of your backers do read). And then bow again, deep!
Sorry, I don’t like it to be negative in posts/replies; alway try to write the “what went well”, but I can’t find one here anymore.
Wow, wasn’t the “first wave” supposed to be shipped in September? Given that it was a very small wave (~200) by all accounts, if you had one teenage intern on the job he/she should have been able to single handedly ship that many tablets in the 2+ weeks since you announced the first small batch. As a matter of fact one intern would have had enough time to package quite a few more tablets for the “second wave” as well, in that time.
This certainly feels like an abandoned boat nobody in the big fleet wants to admit it was abandoned.
Maybe I should just start porting Sailfish onto a tablet I already own and give that to my son for Christmas. And to think I rushed over to Indiegogo the first moment I’ve heard about the project. Tsk Tsk Tsk
I thought we are backers because we want to support a small company and want to experience more excited new features compared with Android and iOS.
But for delaying more than 5-6 months, backers from indiegogo paid on Nov 14 to Feb 15 will get similar shippment schedule with those preorder on Aug and Sep?!
And 1 year after the startup published, the device hasn’t got any hardware upgrade. We are still waiting the device with 1 year before technology spec?!
Cheers Jolla ! Can’t get to get mine 😉
The problem with this apology is that it is apologising for the wrong thing. Delays are a problem of course, but the dreadful communication made things far worse than necessary. Crowdfunding campaigns need a particular pattern of communication with the backers. Has Jolla learned this? I don’t know. I never believed that Jolla had stolen my contribution, but I did wonder sometimes if I would get news that Jolla had run out of money, and was now being run by the bank who had decided to terminate the tablet project.
Upbeat posts and tweets that raise the expectation that something is about to happen, and periods of silence and news blackouts, are a toxic combination. It allows space for harmful speculation and rumour-mongering.
Having said that, I am now really keen to get my tablet. I don’t need no refund option 😉
+1 to that post. Well spoken!
+1 well said.
+1, this!
+1 word!
Dear fearless jolla sailors:
keep calm and carry on.
If your are truly sorry, then please answer the questions that are now being posted . Don’t go silent on us again. You asked for “My personal, heartfelt plea is for your continued support and patience.” No Jolla you can’t have it, you got to EARN it! Now lets see if you are sincere.
+1 Answer the questions!
Thanks for the update. Sad to hear about the delay. But what can be avoided is the silence. This could have been announced a while back. Even now there is no clear indication of the first, second and final waves. These details would set the expectations and also help us plan our schedule.
Too little and too late. If this apology came months, even weeks ago, it’d have made some difference. I am sure many of you share the same sentiment. After feeling so frustrated, I posted a few comments here to communicate with the team. And just like many of yours, mine were indifferently ignored. Sure Jolla, you are a small boat. But we didn’t make the decision for you to go into this OS business. You did, knowing full well there was Google and Apple. Did we ask you to sell us a tablet? No we didn’t. You started it. So you screwed up, okay? Plain and simple. I can understand a start up might make a lot of mistakes. But I cannot and will not tolerate such poor treatment to its backers. So I have written off the contribution to you and you, Jolla as a brand/team/start up, whatever you’d like to call yourselves. Went and bought a Samsung Galaxy Tab 2. So happy with it. Now either I’ll wait till I get it to sell it or I’ll choose the refund option if you come up with one.
Hej Antti,
I am also happy to read this update and as many others , very disappointed with the failure of your success. (as i wrote in my blog last week) see http://bit.ly/1VHlsJz.
Anyway, what has disappointed me the most is that lack of communication regarding shipping. I ordered my tablet on the 19th of November and still i was not on the first round of shipping? why? I do not know if i will be on the second round either??? I have been a backer of Jolla and sailfish from the 1st day and yes, i am frustrated too. but some simple social collaboration would be great for us all.
my wish is that you send me and every other backer an updated ETA for our products.
Hi Gemuir, just as an FYI, there were over 5000 contributors on the 19th of November. However, the first round of shipping only went to something on the order of 200 contributors. So yeah, the vast majority of people who ordered on the 19th are yet to have tablets shipped to them. (And yeah, odds are good that the second round isn’t going to have a vast amount of tablets shipped either…)
In any case, you may be interested in a spreadsheet that TMO member mosen has put together, containing some info on who contributed when, and what their status is for receiving tablets:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1qS0DE4oOf7qPYjwUAaL-rjoPcqu6hHQRJOdspQ4_Hgc/edit#gid=0
Then, second wave must be around 4000, and final wave 4000. This Will be intressting.
Do you know maybe a date of first, second and third wave, since you know the numbers?
Hi @Copernicus, there were actually something between 1800-2500 on the very first day. But their delivery schedule, according to this post, is really quite inaccurate. Hope to see an answer to the very first comment.
Sorry, I had that 5000 number stuck in my head for some reason. 🙂 I stand corrected!
I wouldn’t call it a “failure”, a hindrance in production or development but definitely not a faulure. They did push Sailfish 2.0 in a timely fashion, they acknowledged that there were some issues that were being taken care of, they kept us up-to-date on everything…even the tedious stuff.
Take your time.
Finally some news. My question is, was it so hard to post this months ago and avoid all of “bad” comments? P.S I ordered on January 2015, so I presume, that I can expect in November or possibly December… 🙁 But at least, we have a valid ETA.
Can you please do one more thing, and that is to give us approx. date for each shipment wave. Example Nov 2014-Jan 2015 – first wave, Feb 2015 – Jun 2015 second wave, Jun to Sep, Oct… third wave. We could have at least more information when can we expect it, and that we don’t arrange travels that day. In my case I have still full 30 days of vacation for 2015 (haven’t really been on vacation for this year yet… 🙁 )
I don’t think they are not able to give any indications on that. As I understood from Antti they are short of components. So only about 200-300 tablets are completed and shipped. By the grey boxes on that graph I would say the next batch (perhaps some 4000-5000 units) will go in production by the end of October. And then hopefully it will scale up even further and the rest of the tablets will be ready by the end of November.
So it’s not about the shipping they have problems with. They just don’t have anything to ship…
As I understood, they WERE short on components, and that is why they had delays, but now they are good to go, or am I wrong?
My understanding is more that they missed the windows provided by the factory for production; the parts were not where they needed to be when they needed to be, and therefore nothing was produced. In any case, as all the various misunderstandings are worked out, volume of production should increase correspondingly…
Thanks for the update. It’s alright, I can wait till white Xmas. Whatever you do, please take into account tips and requests of your the community for fixing, optimizing, building more options into, fine-tuning, securing and porting Sailfish OS. 2.0 is far from finished and frankly should co-exist with 1.0 instead of replace it. Options please.
I must admit I started to give up on Jolla. I know how hard it is for startup and it’s rude business where big player get their components before small ones.
Anyway glad to see this post, Now Jolla got fully support back.
Keep going and lets hope no more delays now.
And the most important lets hope you get more SailfishOS attention 2016 and can licence the OS to some big player 🙂
I got a SMS from DHL this morning, hopefully it was about the tablet and not something else I’ve ordered.
And here it is!
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hmhn9zfpfqc6qm4/Jolla_OS_screen.jpg?dl=0
The reflected image of the lamp is as much visible as the real content 🙁
Thanks for an update!
Any news on deliveries to Russia? Will it be 3rd wave regardless of pledges’ queue?
Yes, what about Russian contributors?
Ignoring us is not a solution, Jolla!
I’ve already given my tablet a name: Phantom!
Everyone has heard of – but no one has ever seen it.
Clever, but see https://twitter.com/chc_yabush/status/652109121697656833 for a backer who received it 🙂
To be fair, despite your very disappointing schedule, I still look forward. But I suspect that the “many reasons for these unexpected delays” are kept secret for reasons well beyond the obvious disaster of an ongoing failure to communicate. I wish you did share not only your “current delivery roadmap” (which I’m reasonably sceptical of) but also those reasons: they no doubt make a good story. I hope you’ll deliver it before someone else does. Maybe as a thanks for our trust. I doubt you are able to add anything of more value to the package as a compensation, but that would be nice too.
Captain Antti,
Fair winds and trailing seas, please continue keeping a firm hand on the helm!
I applied to join your crew a fair while ago and remain in port patiently waiting for a wave.
able seaman dave
I don’t care much about delay.
The question I’m asking myself: Will the tablet be available at the store, after the backers have gotten their tablet?
I think it’s a waste of time, invested in Sailfish OS 2.0, if it only runs on a few thousand tablets. It must be able to buy jolla Tablets always to make sure jolla got a chance to be successful.
With any luck, hardware manufacturers such as Intex will soon provide more quantity and variety of hardware platforms for Sailfish than Jolla really could.
Tell you what. Give instructions that work now (give that the old Nokia servers are gone and it is hard to even put a N9 in developer mode) for installing Sailfish on a Nokia N9 and Jolla can take its time on my Tablet. Microsoft doesn’t care about the N9 and its specs are similar to the Jolla phone, so Sailfish should work OK on it 😉
The three problems that I have with this whole thing are:
1. Despite what it says even now on the Jolla website, the Tablet is not really Designed in Finland. The software is, but the hardware isn’t.
2. I don’t think that the crowdfunders have a lot of room to complain. Delays and even non-delivery of items promised to crowdfunders is common. However, the “Aug-Sep 2015” people pre-ordered a product with an “expected” delivery date. Finland is in the EU and wouldn’t this kind of transaction with folk in EU countries be covered by EU consumer rights and laws? They should have done all Tablet sales through IGG with “backers” and “perks” just to make the expectations consistent.
3. Lack of communication. It takes very little time to write a short summary of the current status, get someone to review it and post it. I have a one-man iPhone app shop as a side “business” in addition to my day job. It doesn’t take long to write a little blurb on a regular basis to let my customers know what is up.
Wait, what? Crowdfunders were given an “expected delivery date” as well! Several .. in fact. And in Aug-Sept there were PRE-orders .. not “orders” … there is a difference.
I don’t think people were surprised about SOME delays. I don’t think anyone expected 7-10 months of delays, especially after they showed up at CES with what looked like a nearly finished product. No, friend, this is just a project that has been tossed aside but they are not going to kill because it would look quite bad .. as if it doesn’t look bad already.
Thank you very much for the update. That was urgently needed. To some extend I can understand the complains of the ppl. “standing in line” waiting for their tablets, on the other hand I also see the points mentioned by Jolla.
So to make clear I understand it correctly: everybody that will receive an invite until end of October can be expected to be part of the 2nd wave of delivery (analogous to the 1st one currently in progress). If you don’t get an invitation this month you will likely be handled in the 3rd wave (December)?!?
As you say that taking care of the *independent* SailfishOS is a lot of effort and time why don’t you open-source the whole thing and let the community participate in developing it? Here I mean the OS not just the SDK for writing apps. If you take a look at OpenRepos.net you will find a lot of (unsupported) system extensions build by the community that is enhancing the way the OS works / feels. Why not use this “people power” to boost the development of the *officially supported* OS (the task list on SailfishOS.org is long)?
Happy *sailing* 😉
Is there anyone else that shares my view:
I think Jolla Phone and Jolla Tablet as concept devices that show how the SailfishOS can work on an actual device.
The money that I have been giving to Jolla is my support to them so that they could succeed in getting the OS licensed. That includes the risk they fail (or go rogue) and I don’t see this cool OS to blossom and lost some money. If I would have wanted a ready product (phone or tablet) I could have buyed some Android/iOS/WP devices.
I decided to take the risk and inject money into Jolla and hope they will succeed.
Quote: “We just successfully delivered Sailfish OS 2.0 – the new, fresh version of the Sailfish operating system”. Not true!!!
I have the Jolla phone and it does not have Sailfish OS 2,0. It has Sailfish 1.1.9.28. Where is 2.0?
Just another mistake or what…
Appart from frustration about the delay and the fuzzy communication from Jolla. Please let me jump on some problems raised by your post.
1 – About the delivery and the refunding: On a legal stand point, as Jolla sales from EU, EU consumer rules APPLY. Which means that the failure of Jolla to serve the pre-order on time (ie end of October) open for IMMEDIATE REFUNDING, if requested absolutly not in Jan 2016. Jolla get a community support, that’s great but this does not prevent Jolla to deny to their supporter the right to be a consumer. Consequently the post sentence ‘please bear with us as we will only be able to handle such cases after we have shipped all the tablets’ is highly problematic on a legal stand point (Jolla refuses to apply the EU common consumer protection rights), but also on a customer relationship stand point (personally I feel to be a milking cow). For the crowdfunder, the situation is less clear sorry guys…
2 – About the hardware manufacturing: Even if you have tried to do an empty communication to quiet everybody, your diagram will worry anybody familiar with manufacturing project. The delay in between manufacturing batch and shipment, let suspect that you are still facing hardware issues. Lets be honest here you have done a prod batch, a developer batch then we could expect that if manufacturing is ok, you launch the full batch in manufacturing. If you do solely a small in October it means that there still some issues and you will wait for the post sale service feedback before launching additional batches. What reinforce this impression, is the small letter sentence in the diagram for the last batch: ‘components order ‘ which would start end of October (so few weeks after first delivery).
As conclusion, thanks for your (partial?) honesty, however your communication worry me more than quiet me. It’s clearly highlight that the hardware design is not fully satisfying for your stand point and that the manufacturing process is clearly out of control. This also mean that the risk of additional delay is pretty high. We wish all to Jolla a great success, however I am sad to see, that based on these episodes, there is still a huge improvement needed before being able to join the unicorn world.
Yours faithfully
Got my tablet!
It’s stunning, the display is seriously amazing. And the OS feels great on this hardware, really instantly responding.
Can’t install 3rd party apps though, not sure why. Untrusted software installation is enabled but installations end with ‘Problem with installing’.
Congrats Jolla, this is a really fantastically premium product to be launched by such a small company. Kudos!
Try to check and set up correct Date on the device. If date isn’t correct it may cause such problems.
Oh yeah, they are compiled for ARM, not intel… tricky!
You can try installing the latest modRana package from OpenRepos:
https://openrepos.net/content/martink/modrana-0
ModRana is written in Python, so the package is architecture independent. 🙂 Also I’m really interested how well (if at all :D) it works on the Jolla Tablet. 🙂
ModRana installed just fine and runs, icons are all overly large and quite jagged at the edges, I guess it’s only to be expected when it’s zoomed so much.
We believe in your team, don’t worry!:)
Thank you Antti for the update however the “Roadmap” seems incomplete and lacking in real detail. Emails were sent to the lucky people in the first batch some weeks ago but the tablets were only just sent. The suggestion now is that the next batch will be sent in November but there seems to be no mention of when invitation emails will be sent. With the current delay between invitation and dispatch can we expect to receive our invite now or at the start of November? Where will the tablets be shipped from and with which carrier on what shipment priority? These are all questions that are unanswered. How many were sent in the first batch and how does this relate to the size of the total orders?
This further delay and missed commitment really calls for more than a small image file without dates or detail. As Magritte might say – This is not a Roadmap!
Can we have a further update please?
I think the current delay between invitation and dispatch was caused by this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/china-traffic-jam-golden-week_5616c82ae4b0dbb8000da85d
So, it should be faster for future shipments…
Refund sounds very good at this point. I’d like to opt out completely. Biggest mistake I’ve ever made was to give a penny to this company.
In that roadmap is “component order” in November for third batch. Why extra component order for second and for third batch? Wouldn’t it be better to order all components together than risk another delay in components delivery?
Still I don’t know if I will receive one day the invitation to get the tablet, I’ve done the indigogo on 8th December with the addon 64Gb on 27 feb.
I’m seeing people starting to get their tablet when contributed around 20 November ?
Hope all of this has a end. I would like to use it during a week-seminar, beginning of November 😉
WE ARE ALL INVESTORS. The question is: Should we invest one times more? I think so. We learned that a schedule plan is only a plan and Jolla learned one time more, that investors love results.
What’s with the communication?
If Jolla explains month by month the same stuff we would complaints too: “Don’t jabber if you provide news.” “We don’t believe you!”, “All is great hustle!”
Conclusion
Wait. Don’t cry. Bolster the Jolla team. Don’t leave up the market Samsung and Apple.
Best Regards
Chris
Finally:
an industrial project always has difficulties.
I also see it in my field: valves and fittings.
With patience I continue to support the project Jolla Tablet!
I believe that all the Jolla team works with the passion and the desire of a truth beautiful result!
I must say I am disappointed.
I put my faith in Jolla and bought the smartphone.
I then put more faith in Jolla and made a contribution through Indiegogo for the Tablet.
It was late in coming and then I was ‘skipped’ over on the first batch an was never informed when I can expect to receive the Tablet. And so…I am disappointed. Antti Saarnio appology is the least we can expect.
Thank you for the update Antti. You should do this more often though, as it really eases the wait and cuts the rumours while making the trolls look like idiots. I want to be informed and I’d really like to read more Jolla blogs and less random speculation.
Nov. 21, 2014
no invitation mail for me
Hi,
I ordered 2 tablets.
One for my 11 year old boy (taking into account a few months delay).
What should I tell him? October, November or December?
Basically you are telling us that you are telling nothing.
You should take Jolla customers seriously. Though marketing people may think otherwise, Jolla users are not the infantiles that sleep outside a store to get a silly trendy phone.
I am seriously worried about the current management of Jolla. Can’t help smelling a strong Google/Apple scent along this latest briefing.
i ordered 8/22/2015 an expected delivery end of october. have i know wait til end of december?
Hi,
Thanks for update, but sadly it didn’t give any new information. What I really like is some tentative date when I can get this tablet.
I am early contributor, not receive invitation yet & no idea when I am going to receive that. Atleast tell me when I will receive the invitation, and then tablet. Give me some tentative date.
We are being fooled. I don’t expect my tablet to appear before 2016.
Please Jolla, NEVER try to build any hardware again.
And get a decent communications officer.
Don’t forget Jolla is a startup. Don’t expect everything works from the start.
It is not. and is not a licence to fail.
No matter for me,i’ll wait patiently when it comes, the os will better fit in it. 🙂
many Thanks for the update.
I am pleased that Jolla has not only survived, but is going to deliver. I was worried they would sink like the KDE Spark/Vivaldi project.
I respect communication like this.
Japanese bow reciprocated.
Yay! So By that chart I finally have a estimation of my tablet’s shipping date at least. first wave is fully shipped around mid October, and that’s next week and the week after that.
Got to say, all the comments saying that more information even if it would be the degree of “we need to recheck our date estimations due to unspecified problems” would keep me not maybe happy, but to give me a feeling that as *I* am contributing to you, and you are appreciating us enough that we’d be part of the team.
+1 to your ending
Thanks for the info. I will wait as long as needed. Just keep on the good work!
Seeing happy people’ posts on twitter. People are receiving their tablets. Great!
Now, I am asking once again. What about contributors from Russia?
I do not want to intrude, but about delivery in Russia has not been ANY news. Explain please, when to wait for delivery in Russia?
Will we be given the option to change our delivery address? as mine has changed since I first backed the project on indiegogo over a year ago and then confirmed it months ago.
The option for a refund before receiving the product may be a good one too. I don’t think I longer have the need for a out of date tablet now…
Seriously? Seriously? Instead of gathering forces in order to get the mess done with, the whole matter is passed until … yes, until when? I was actually expecting to take the tablet on a trip in November, but guess what, this might not happen now.
What kind of project and risk management is this supposed to be? Do you really expect us to believe that from now on all will work smoothly and without problems or difficulties? Really? Stuff happens, you know? And those things are generally unpredictable in scale and impact. At the moment I have the feeling that the chances to see Godot are comparably higher than receiving the tablet this year.
I will wait until 2020 to get this tablet. We need SailFish OS. And if you need our help to carry the load, then say so! I’d love to help develop the OS, find and fix bugs–whatever I can do to help.
OK, I joked about ‘russisch Untermensch’ on TJC, but it seems less and less of a joke to me. Could you PLEASE say SOMETHING about shipping to Russia? I am perfectly ready to hear anything of the following:
“We want to send all Russian tablets in one batch to reduce costs so you’ll have to wait a month more”
“Your russian customs are f*cked up so you’ll probably receive your tablet in 2016”
“You are evil aggressors who invaded poor Ukraine so no tablet for you”
ANYTHING would be better than complete neglect.
“You are evil aggressors who invaded poor Ukraine so no tablet for you”
You know, I’d completely forgotten that there’s still some sort of embargo going on between various countries and Russia due to this conflict. I don’t remember electronic devices being on the list of proscribed items, but I wouldn’t be surprised if there were political considerations slowing down trade across borders…
I’m agree, questions about delivery to Russia get instant ignoring.
I don’t care! Jolla still rocks…
Now let’s see… I got “Tule mukaan” IndieGoGo campaign mail 19.11.2014 11:06, and I got the “Thank you for your support!” mail 19.11.2014 12:25.
Taking more than an hour I was so “late” that I will get my tablet a month or two later than the “early” ones? 🙁
I got my email at 11.07 and received my tablet today. So I think that the email time is not very reliable indicator on how early or late someone was, as there can be considerable delays in transit.
I suppose you got the “Thank you for your support!” mail 11:07? I got it 12:25.
And my timezone is Finland, +2.
Yes, and Finland too.
Interesting, so much for sending then “in order of contribution”.
I’m happy for those who finally got their tablets, but now I have some questions for Jolla: where is mine and what happened with the “order of contribution”?
Kismet 🙂
I’m surprised by seeing people saying “ordered at indiegogo” – nothing has been ordered there, just invested…
Sure the communication of Jolla team is pretty bad, but they just have started and you just have “invested” in their future.
It’s better not to be frustrated and wait for the product which will be shipped soon. I mean, it’s really soon since we have waited almost 1 year and we receive it by the end of this year.
It’s very sad to see that you are only trying to buy time by just posting an apology letter. We wanted you to communicate but not like this. A post and then go to sleep. Just answer some of the common Questions like what do you mean by WAVE – 1st = How many in there?
2nd Wave = how many in there?
3rd & final wave how many?
Talking of refund at this stage….not a good idea. It should have been the option long back.
Again ******** please explain the WAVE system.***********
It is merely “talk” of a refund. They are “looking into it” which means it won’t happen.
I’m really happy, that Jolla has managed to actually produce the tablet – thanks a lot, I can’t wait to get it. I think it will be a great device and not because of the hardware, but because of the great operating system!
@All the sailors: don’t be too harsh on Jolla: it is really difficult and expensive to produce hardware – anyone remember the KDE tablet attempt Vivaldi? While Jolla tablet is not completely open as Vivaldi was meant to be, it’s still much better than the absolutely closed iPads or Android tablets, where one is completely in the vendor’s mercy.
… and it’s way more beautiful!
Thank you Jolla!
Thanks, no matter how long it takes. I’m glad that there are companies like Jolla out there creating alternatives to Android, iOS, and Windows. It’s an uphill battle, and with the very short product cycles delays are hard to communicate. But when I get my SailfishOS tablet, it will be a very special device. Keep fighting!
+1
+1!
+1 !!
+1 🙂
> Typically only huge “cargo ships” like Google (Android) and Apple (iOS) carry operating systems as cargo.
Guys, come on. You’re a niche product. Stop comparing yourselves to Apple and Google, you’re not competing in the same league. And if you do feel it necessary to compare yourselves to these companies, remember that when they announce a device they ship it on schedule.
> At the same time we are preparing the second batch and aim to start shipping at the beginning of November.
Great non-answer. We already know this. Tell us the amount of tablets in each batch, so we can calculate when ours may be shipped. This is what we have been asking for in the blog comments for months, and this post did exactly nothing to answer our questions.
> I want to again personally apologize for the inconvenience and frustration this has caused. More than that, I want to thank you for your contribution to this project, without which we honestly would not have been able to get here. My personal, heartfelt plea is for your continued support and patience.
My personal, heartfelt plea, is that you guys learn some PR and start giving us concrete details, not graphics meant for a PowerPoint presentation to sell yourself.
Words are cheap, and this apology reads like someone who got told “backers are pissed off, write an apologetic blog post to shut them up for a while.”
Put your money where your mouth is: release the size of the batches and the precise shipping schedule. Update backers frequently through Twitter, Zendesk, and the blog if the schedule slips.
Yes, you’re small. Yes, you have to maintain an OS and “build” hardware. That’s still NO EXCUSE for the absolutely horrible communication you guys have engaged in since the first IGG campaign.
Sorry but I cannot agree with the excuse like we are buildinh OS. OS is based on linux, and kernel is linux. At least 95% is linux and src code is already available in public, so what you guys need to do is write support for custom hardware and GUI, which is not nearly compley as developing a new kernel. I am not saying that you are twiddling fingers, but excuse like building whole new OS is just silly. It is Liux. Kernel written by Linus Torvalds and rest of kickass developers (Intel, RedHat, IBM…). I agree with you whr you said “wave” system should be explained, because it really looks like you are only trying to buy a time…
An OS is not only a kernel.
Sure, the kernel is probably the most important part and writing one from scratch is almost impossible in this day and age (Google didn’t, but Android is similar as my Debian box as iOS is), but Sailfish is not only “a common GNU/Linux distribution + hw adaptation + UI”.
Ideally it is, as Sailfish is built upon Mer/Nemo on which Jolla sailors contribute in a very large part, in the open.
There is everything in-between the Kernel and the UI (“middleware”) which is important and probably more difficult to develop than the UI.
The fact that they used a common stack shared for the most part with desktop Linux distributions is great (and was actually one of the selling points of the Jolla phone and Sailfish for me), but it’s not as easy to develop on as you are making it sound. Especially when targetting a total different market (production mobile devices).
It’s an huge job, probably the most difficult part in the Jolla Tablet project. That obviously doesn’t justify the delays (after all, the software is ready for everyday use).
Don’t underestimate prometheus, seeing his comments history, I’m sure he could build his own OS in a couple of months if he wanted. Oh wait, this history also tells that he doesn’t know what C++ looks like. So, I really wonder how he can affirm such things…
Great to hear that. I was quite stuck between the desire to get my first tablet in years and the will to support Jolla in developing Sailfish OS with my contribution to which I’m quite dedicate to.
Over the weeks without any delay-informations I got a little uncomfortable. I started thinking too that the most important thing about this campaign was getting my money.
Anyway I still love Jolla and it’s Sailfish. It’s my favorite answer to the Android-Apple-War and my concerns about privacy! Keep movin on my fellow Sailors. And perhaps you could try to improve the communication with your supporters around the world for next time!?
will this opt out option be available after the waves? If so. dont you think its to late? plz make it availabe before next shipment speed up the total delivery circle .
Very disappointed with the reply.
Now the only issues are invitation and shipping, so pleas just write a webpage that shows how many invitation have been sent, maybe with estimates of contribution date/time. And another chart shows how many units have been shipped.
I think every bakers will be happy about that. You are leaving us all in darkness to find out how many invitations have been sent. I contributed on 11/20, but even some guys before me haven’t got invitations… I think that’s why so many bakers are mad.
“Now the only issues are invitation and shipping…”
Well, no, actually; they’ve succeeded in both sending invitations (and receiving replies) and shipping tablets out to contributors. Those activities scale very well, so there should be no problem performing them for all the rest of the contributors.
What they haven’t yet been able to do is actually produce the tablet in sufficient volume. Issues with logistics and with factory schedules have been holding up progress. The rate at which Jolla will be able to fulfill orders in the future is entirely dependent on how quickly the factory will be able to crank out more tablets.
So yeah, there’s really no point for Jolla to give any concrete numbers right now, as they have no direct control over the numbers. We’ll just have to see how well the factory can manage in the next few weeks.
I must say that as a project manager in a software company, if you need help regarding communication and project managemement, just call me 🙂
This blog article if so full of fuzzy words than even after reading twice we do not have any more information than before. “wave” “batch” “certainly” are just weasel words.
I do not mind you being late even if now with the money I put in your crowdfunding I could have had already a tablet with better components. I mind when I ask a simple question “when I will be delivered” and noone can answer to this question. If this question cannot be answered then we have a serious issue.
This is not okay. IGG backers knew what they were getting into, the inherent risks of backing a startup, etc. etc. But when you took preorder money through your own sales channel while making an October launch part of your marketing campaign, you no longer have the luxury of hiding behind IGG’s “no refunds and you might not ever get anything at all” policy. You collected preorder funds up front and the consequences of nonfulfillment of those legally binding contracts is going to make some manufacturing delays the least of your (apparently many) problems.
I suggest that you cease “looking into” refunds for preorder customers and start issuing them immediately upon request. We are not “backers” or “investors”, we are paying customers that you owe a product delivery in October. If you can’t honor that commitment, you refund.
A little editorial commentary to go with my demand for a refund:
Startups liked Jolla love their David vs. Goliath narrative… taking on corporate behemoths like Google and Apple and winning on some differentiating factor like “passion” or better customer service or agility.
Of course, as this and thousands of other failed crowdfunding campaigns demonstrate with regularity, that’s all a marketing-speak smokescreen. The primary goal of a tech startup is no less the acquisitiom of as much consumer money as possible, by any means necessary. They want their funds up front and immediately within their narrow campaign time windows, but they quickly dispose of any notions of timely fulfillment once they have the money in hand. The excuse? “We’re a small company”. Nonsense. They’re doing the exact same thing an Apple or Microsoft or Google is doing, just at smaller scale and with far less bureaucratic bloat.
This is inevitably the point where the company’s marketing person per some whiteknight fan will cry foul that small companies have to deal with a rigged game. Here are their top three most common deflections:
1. Retail channels won’t carry their products until they prove themselves but they can’t prove themselves without retail exposure.
2. Manufacturer cycles are hard to come by with larger companies eating up all of Foxconn’s bandwidth.
3. They don’t have dedicated staff to handle customer support, shipping, order fulfillment, etc. so every minute that one of their employees spends on those critical business functions is a loss of opportunity for product development and yet another justification for delays.
Response to each of these fallacies:
1. This campaign demonstrates exactly why retailers lock startups out of their channel. Retailers live and die by customer satisfaction, and they’re not going to collect preorders for a company who feels like it can delay a product launch by half a year with no customer consequences. Chargebacks cost money, and so does operating effective tier 1, first-party customer support. Crowdsourcing exists to give startups a chance to prove themselves, not as an alternative retail channel. When you run your crowdsourced campaigns like this, you can’t blame retailers for lack of market penetration. Blame yourselves for showing the world you can’t perform to your own marketing promises, even at a small scale.
2. Maybe you should stop overstating “Made in Finland” or “Made with <3" in your marketing speak as a differentior from the big boys then. There's nothing special about sending your electronic designs off to the same massive sweatshops in China to be manufactured. Maybe find a startup partner in the manufacturing space or *gasp* price your product fairly for how special it's supposed to be and build it yourself? If diminished access to the manufacturing pipeline is an ongoing problem that causes you to repeatedly fail in your delivery of goods and services to customers, you solve that as part of your corporate SoPs and stategic partnerships. You don't go back to your customers and try to rationalize your failure to deliver on your own promises by blaming component shortages or small windows of opportunity in the manufacturing space. Those may be facts of life in tech, but your customer doesn't care. They just want their product to be high quality AND timely. If it can't be both because of factors beyond your control, why are you even here?
3. This is my favorite. Do you guys really think the corporate bureaucracies and high head counts at big companies make them more agile? You do understand that they are running multiple projects at once as well where you only have to deal with one, right? Moreover, do you really think having dedicated operations and support staff for a high tech product prevents those engagements from just being thrown over the wall to your engineers once "hold down the power button for 10 seconds and retry" fails? Do you actually believe that having a warehouse full of big strong dudes sitting around doing nothing 90% of the time because China can't produce your product fast enough is going to speed up packaging and shipping? Most startup employees expect to wear many hats, and if they manage their schedules well (which Jolla clearly doesn't), you have engineers available to field customer service calls while waiting for "wave 3" manufacturing and marketing people available to box and ship once last week's campaign is out the door. If these people aren't willing or able to pivot in their daily duties without sabotaging the entire project, that begs the questions a) why are they working at a startup in the first place and b) why does management continue to hire and retain one trick ponies when they need one man bands? With poor coordination (because it does happen that very hard-working people are just being directed by idly wealthy idiots or "visionaries" with no business trying to be managers), you can have the most talented people in the world expending massive effort and still not moving a project forward, much the same as a hamster running very fast in a wheel is still not moving.
So why not, instead of blaming everyone but yourselves, try a real apology focusing on the failure to do the things you CAN control, like communication, refund policy, answering zendesk tickets, revising timing estimates and being more transparent about "wave" sizes. THESE are the things you don't see Google or Microsoft giving their customers insight into, and a place you could offer a real differentiating factor for your business, if only you'd bother to do them.
People love an underdog. People don't love underdogs who act the same as the establishment and care only about collecting sympathy money. You guys just need to try much, much harder, as you're not only failing at product development but in building your fan base as well.
+1 That was worth reading through, twice!
Just a quick comment: “You do understand that they are running multiple projects at once as well where you only have to deal with one, right?”
Maybe it’s just my imagination, but it seems to me like Jolla is running a _whole lot_ of projects right now, of which only the Phone and the Tablet are really visible. In fact, so far as I can tell, the Phone and the Tablet aren’t even intended as products to be sold for a profit; they’re instead marketing tools for Sailfish.
Jolla’s actual customers are companies like Intex. While it would be nice if they could put a little more effort into customer service for their retail products, it makes little financial sense to do so, as they _have no intention_ of ever producing future phones or tablets…
R&D and concept work are not really “projects” at the same level as establishing an actual good or service for which money is changing hands, and should never come at the expense of fulfilling existing commitments. Point taken however about sailfish os being the overarching project with these hardware efforts falling more under the category of distribution vehicle for the core product rather than products in themselves from a corporate strategy perspective.
Still that’s no excuse for the complete customer neglect on display here. What we seem to be witnessing is a software development company that has grossly underestimated the complexity involved in producing tangible goods. Rather than making things right financially for the customer as any reputable retailer would do, they are hiding behind the “backer” concept and keeping the money, even for preorder customers who were acquired through a direct sales channel. Not cool, and ultimately self-defeating. A niche product needs its hardcore fan base to survive. Alienate that group at your peril.
“What we seem to be witnessing is a software development company that has grossly underestimated the complexity involved in producing tangible goods.” — Yeah, I gotta say, I’ve seen this so many times over the years now, I wonder if they shouldn’t start teaching some basic manufacturing concepts to every child in school (just in case they end up starting a company). 🙂
But still, I didn’t mean that Jolla is involved in lots of R&D or concept projects. They are doing their BRICS strategy; even before the Intex announcement, they had serious talks going on in Russia (which were all over the news). And they’ve certainly been involved with folks in China from the very beginning. I would imagine that they are seriously pursing leads in other areas of the world as well.
So yeah, they may not be doing a great job serving the folks who have backed their Phone and their Tablet, but they cannot build a future on the measly income they derive from those products. They need to place all of their focus on customers that can provide them enough income to remain in business, and I’m afraid that wouldn’t be us…
Customers don’t care about slim margins. If you bring a product, any product, to market, you support it on both the order/fulfillment and tech sides. If you don’t, your corporate motive is immaterial.
By your logic, neither Microsoft nor Sony should offer any customer support for their gaming consoles because they don’t make their money on the hardware. You can’t build a new business by being hostile to your core customer and ignoring the reality of what consumers expect at a base level when money changes hands.
Well I guess you can, but it seems quite silly to put any real investment of time and money into such an obviously doomed venture. Good thing they don’t have actual investors to answer to… just this subspecies of “backers” and “preorders” who can be milked for cash regardless of fulfillment outcome.
“Customers don’t care about slim margins.”
Yup, and companies don’t care about consumers that provide them with slim margins, either. 🙂 No point in trying to make long-term friends with folks who will never be more than a financial drain on your company. Neither the Phone nor the Tablet have an actual future. (Or, at least, they didn’t before Jolla mentioned the potential hardware spinoff company; that might change the situation.)
Game consoles are an entirely different kettle of fish. Yes, most of the money Microsoft and Sony make comes from licensing fees from each software title sold; but still, these consoles are sold in volumes reaching tens or even hundreds of millions of units. At this level, you can arrange for some serious economies of scale; I don’t think either company is really losing too much money per unit, even if it looks that way from external analyses of the devices.
But in any case, Jolla DOES have actual investors to answer to. And they are answering them; they’ve decided to completely cut off all attempts to mess with consumer hardware after the tablet (which of course was never intended as a money-making exercise to begin with), and concentrate on where their real business lies — licensing Sailfish to various regional hardware manufacturers.
I agree with you completely that Jolla does not give a damn about their hardware customers. That much is clear.
But would it not make infinitely more sense to either not bring the product to market at all if unable to meet customer expectations or to price it such that it becomes profitable enough to motivate them to meet these expectations?
To abuse the nautical metaphor further, they’ve chosen to let the ship sink because they’re unwilling to toss back the gold in the cargo hold.
Thanks for the apology!
For once the CEO admits, and apologizes for what is happening.
Keep up I’ll wait even till JAN to have a LINUX tablet in my hands.
My next workplace will be something completely new with existing technologies but kinda new OS. 2 Years delay.
So you are still doing good.
Keep up the work and make the LINUX guys like me happy!
Cheers
Mark
“refund option” I would interested to use this option or to swap with somebody who want it. From 1st march I already bought 2 other tablets and I really don’t need 3rd one.
I payed on 1st March, and opted for 64gb model.
Jolla, could you please let us know when this option will be available?
Im not planning to refund and get my jPad even if I completely given up on this tablet. not having an refund option after all this time available is simply not cool.
Hope the ones looking for refund can do that tommorrow.
Hope the ones longing for tablet gets it tomorrow.
Another slightly disappointed 19th of Nov backer here who is now starting to wonder if Jolla and Sailfish OS has a future. I can understand the lack of communication and details if these issues relate to non disclosure agreements with partners, but I get the feeling it has more to do with corporate culture, perhaps inherited from Nokia or imposed by the investors. As with many others, this update was not very informative.
I never expected Jolla to break into the mainstream consumer market, at least not in the short term, and
compare themselves to Google or Apple or compete directly with these companies. I always thought of this project as an initiative to make a Linux distribution for mobile hardware and cater to the needs of people who find value in and would like to help developing such products.
As such, I hoped that “People powered” would mean open communication and top-to-bottom open source code (or at least have a very clear road map for this), with a vibrant external developer community providing patches and ideas for directions. AFAIK, Android and in particular CyanogenMod is doing better from this this perspective. I was also hoping that Jolla would be open to bootstrap a wider community by helping to port the OS to other hardware, which in itself could have helped kickstarting app development for the platform. The Other Half concept that could have enabled unique mobile hardware modding was never really explored or promoted by Jolla and is now abandoned for the tablet.
Jolla had an opportunity to turn its project into the Raspberry Pi of mobile platforms and open up a completely new market but instead went for more conventional commercial product development, which as we can see is very difficult for a small startup. That said, I still hope they will succeed and be profitable in this space but I have my doubts.
When is the refund option will be available?
As soon as the refund option become available, i’d be all over it! I don’t want this “Ancient” table anymore.
Hey Gandalf, Any news from Helms deep?
Oh, I’m sure right now he’s off admiring the glittering caves of Aglarond.
Er, how do LotR references fit in to this discussion? 🙂
One Tablet to rule them all, One Tablet to find them,
One Tablet to bring them all and in the darkness bind them.
I have heard people calling it My Precious. Scary.
🙂 Funny thing though, seems like most of the folks posting here are ready to chuck the thing right into Orodruin as soon as they get it…
It’s easy to say when they haven’t felt the power of one tablet.
Ah, I think you’re slipping into Star Wars here. 😉
Jolla, Use the force and release the source.
No need to use the Force, when you can just use your browser. 🙂 Here’s a link to Jolla’s repository for releases of most of their (non-GUI) source code:
http://releases.sailfishos.org/sources/
The Source is strong with this one.
Actually there’s only about 4 people who would do such a thing. I have complained about this whole mess but I will keep it whenever it gets here, I’m giving it to my son, and I’ll probably order one more , of they still have some. Much easier and elegant than trying to port Sailfish on some other tablet.
+1. 🙂 Yeah, I’m getting too worked up over the folks here venting their spleen all over this blog. I’ve finally pulled down the SDK with the tablet support, so it’s time I stopped playing around here and got my head back into some code…
Still waiting for my preorder refund ticket to be answered /crickets
Normally when one apologizes and insists on how sincere the apology is, that comes with a commitment to do better and some actual follow-up. I feel as though there was some degree of intent in holding back this announcement just long enough for the PayPal buyer protection period and most credit card companies’ dispute windows to close.
You need to start issuing refunds right now. You have already destroyed your reputation and any consumer goodwill you might have had; now you’re trying to keep the money too. If the goal of this project is to establish long-term viability of your OS, you have chosen a strange way of going about that, exposing yourself to legal challenges and fines under very strict EU consumer protection laws rather than simply refunding money you shouldn’t have collected until shipment in the first place.
This is why we can’t have nice things. Far too many Steve Jobs wannabes out there who believe that their “vision” alone is a monetizable commodity.
Actually, I take the fact that they were able to juxtapose this apology with reports of the first happy backers receiving their tablets as the main reason why they chose this particular moment to post this blog entry when they did. 😉
So, in your mind, I’m not entitled to have my money back… why, precisely?
Isn’t it still my money since nothing has been provided in exchange?
Both EU and US regulations say it is.
Ok, here’s the thing:
1) Jolla offered a product, but gave no clear indication of exactly when that product would be delivered.
2) Jolla is making a good-faith effort to actually produce and distribute that product.
3) Actual backers have now started to receive that product.
4) All indications are that all backers will in fact receive the product.
5) There is already a procedure in place to receive a refund if the product is returned.
I don’t really see that Jolla is trying to steal money from anyone here. It’s just that they’ve set up an incredibly inconvenient mechanism, one that brings the end-user in at the beginning of the manufacturing process rather than at the end of the process. As such, concepts like “refund” are a little hazy, as you now need to figure out whether the end-user is an “investor” or a “consumer”, as different rules (and expectations!) apply to the different categories.
Certainly, the folks complaining here don’t believe that they are investors, which is the heart of the problem. (And why I believe crowdfunding will eventually fail and disappear, as crowds are never rational.)
You’re a doughty supporter of Jolla, but whilst I still agree with your basic premise, that we crowd-funders are supporters\contributors\investors, not “customers” this doesn’t excuse Jolla’s poor performance.
The crux of this problem, and the root of most of the disappointment is that Jolla’s biggest failure has been one of communication.
The whole point of being a “supporter” (etc.) is that many\most of us early “sailors” sincerely wanted\want Jolla\Sailfish to succeed. We want to be part of something outside the mainstream of iOS\Android.
However that’s not enough. We also want to feel “involved”.
I have no idea how much effort Jolla is currently putting in to the Tablet: in development production, or fulfilment, and that’s the problem. However thinly spread their resources, they must prioritise a bit of reciprocal support for those of us who have supported them with our cash.
Assuming their Fulfilment system is a standard computerised one it should take a matter of seconds to extract enough information to be able to give reasonably accurate timelines for to whom & when Tablets will be delivered. They must have these data in order simply to function.
All I want is some transparency, some indication, outside platitudes, that they genuinely care.
Please don’t conflate people who invested through crowdfunding with those who ordered a product from an online store with a clear expectation that they are customers with rights under relevant consumer statutes, not voluntary backers.
Apart from that, nothing you wrote has any bearing on whether the company should be offering refunds at the very least to their direct channel customers, if not everyone. This should be a conversation about the right thing to do for a company trying to penetrate a crowded market and NEEDING the support of the very people they are robbing and underservicing, if not about avoiding the utter dissolution of the company through regulatory action.
First, I think the term “pre-order” is pretty self-explanatory: you’re paying money before a product is available. Therefore, you should have no expectation that you will immediately receive the product, as is not yet available. At least this seems logical to me…
Second, they do not need the support of anyone ordering a tablet, as they will never receive enough money from the people ordering the tablet to make it a profitable venture. The ONLY true value they receive from this tablet is to show to their real customers (i.e., mobile equipment manufacturers currently using Android on their machines) that Sailfish is a viable product.
In a sense, this is even a winning strategy, because:
a) Potential licensees can see that there is significant interest in Sailfish by a large potential group of users.
b) Potential licensees can also see that this group is underserved by the products provided by Jolla itself, and therefore have a great chance to market their products to a user base already primed to buy something better.
It is far more rational to have an expectation of October delivery when the preorder campaign stated that customers could expect October delivery than to be making a hundred different excuses for nonfulfillment that ignore the objective reality of consumer expectations in the year 2015 and the age of Amazon.com, ad well as relevant statutes that are very clear on this matter.
Then again I don’t expect rationality from frothing white knight fanboys hell-bent on making sure anyone demanding proper treatment of customers is somehow lacking in rational faculty or have some sort of entitlement issue.
If you think a brand new company like Jolla doesn’t absolutely need the support of every single individual reading this right now to be successful, that’s beyond irrational. That’s delusional.
Funny thing about brand-new companies; they often make mistakes, and only rarely make a smooth transition into wealthy money-making enterprise able to cater to every whim of their customers. 🙂
But then I’m an irrational frothing-at-the-mouth white knight fanboy hell-bent on disparaging you in every way possible, so please just ignore everything I’ve written.
I’ll readily concede at this point that we’re never going to agree, and that’s okay. You seem predisposed to consider Jolla’s attempt to produce hardware in the first place nothing more than a strategic misstep, and handwave away the fact that customers are the ones paying for that misstep. Fine. You also seem driven to put the near term profitability of the company above its ethical and legal obligations, not to mention sacrificing its reputation in the industry before it is even fully developed. Your prerogative.
All I want is a refund and I simply don’t understand why you’re so opposed to me getting one.
Ah, trolls. Was to be expected after the Norse sagas.
Sigh.
I’ve spent some time thinking about the subject. I didn’t think I was personally opposed to you getting a refund; but yeah, you’ve made me rethink my position in more detail.
When you come right down to it, the question becomes: what is Jolla? We have here a group of people who have been doing the hard work to resurrect a really beautiful mobile operating system from the rubble left in the wake of Nokia’s collapse.
Ultimately, I want Sailfish to succeed.
Final success here is a world in which multiple mobile device providers have Sailfish-based devices available, in the same manner as Android. I think that’s pretty clear. Jolla has certainly taken several steps in this direction, and with the Intex announcement, it appears they are finally reaching fruition in their efforts.
And yes, along the way, they have brought out the Phone and the Tablet. But Jolla is not Apple. It is not Samsung. It is not producing these devices in large volumes, nor providing them quickly to market, nor providing them with a great deal of support.
Every step of the way, Jolla has informed us that the tablet is a work in progress, that if we order now, we won’t get the thing immediately. We handed over our money understanding this fact.
Most of us, anyway. Some of us have decided that Jolla is jerking us around, is sitting around fat and lazy and stealing our money.
I believe that point of view is incorrect. I believe it is _unseemly_. It detracts from the real work Jolla has been doing, and from the support that the majority of us have lent to them with our orders.
Yes, in the end, I do believe you should get your refund. But I don’t like the fact that you are spitting on Jolla and on all the rest of us by asking for it.
You kinda miss a little fact:
Not everybody invested during the crowdfunding campaign. they also run preorders with delivery stated for October.
Pre-ordering is not crowdfunding.
Fact is, Jolla will not succeed like this. I’m still unsure whether or not do go for the refund. I want SailfishOS to succeed, but I lost trust in Jolla. And when hardcore Open Source and Linux fanboys like me stop rooting for Jolla, their chances are bad.
Please, all pre-order folks, check the FAQ:
https://jolla.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/207297218-I-want-to-pre-order-a-Jolla-Tablet
It states under setion 2 that if you want to cancel your pre-order, you should send a support request via this link:
https://jolla.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/requests/new
I don’t know if you’ll get an immediate refund, but it seems to use a different mechanism than the indiegogo system.
Jolla fan club TO THE RESCUE!
Keep their money guys, anyone complaining about being ripped off is just a troll.
White knights are so predictable.
Keith, I would expect that if you wanted a refund and didn’t like Jolla’s options you could invoke a dispute with PayPal for non-delivery. Which given that they chose to do it all through PayPal they would have no choice but to comply.
Wow, keith, don’t you think you’re overly dramatic?
Dear Jolla, some basics of blogging:
When one writes a blog post with comments enabled, it’s both common and polite to answer any comments, and especially when they include a question.
I just checked there are almost 70 questions, more than 20 relevant (and different), but only 3 of them answered. Please start either commenting back, or disable the whole commenting system in your future blog posts guiding any questions to other channels where they get answered. Thanks 🙂
add to that if jolla answers some questions I would assume that the overall quality of the comments would improve…Drastically
I agree. Even a “we don’t have any numbers to share before (date)” to the very first question would have cleared out this comment thread drastically, adding supportive commenting. Now we’ll probably just see tens of more similar questions later.
Can’t but agree.
Hi, completely disappointing after reading this update that jolla tablets will be delivered by Dec 2015(which am sure will not be). i am among the first contributors who ordered jolla tablets. No charms no enthusiasm now for these tablets as already 1 year over. Always we are getting a new excuse from you guys. If you guys can not make it on time then you should give us option to cancel our order and ill be the first to cancel it.
My second point you should offer compensation for this huge delay with some thing like any accessory to early contributors…and No thanks
Because answering all questions here and making comments to the postings would take one or two employees the whole day long, I would prefer to disable commenting at all. People at Jolla are needed to complete the Tablet and shipping orders, not to discuss about this and that…!
Every company dealing with customers must provide the answers to all their customers one way or the other, so closing commenting might not actually reduce the needed working hours. On the opposite, a fast public answer prevents similar questions to appear. However, an unanswered blog comment thread is just bad for the PR, and for that reason I suggested that commenting here could be shut down.
200ich tablets sent? what happens now?
Something I thought about over the weekend:
There have been a lot of responses to these various posts saying, “I want the tablet that I purchased.” Then, inevitably, there will the response of, “You didn’t ‘purchase’ anything. You invested. There is no guarantee that you will ever receive the perk.” This is all well and good, but if we are not customers (someone who goes to a vendor and purchases a product/service) then we are investors, as I am not aware of any category in-between those two very different relationships (if there is such a thing, please feel free to correct me). If then, we are investors and not customers it seems even more of a problem that the company in which we have invested in would be handcuffed by an NDA. It seems to me, at least logically, perhaps not legally, that you do not keep investors in the dark with things like NDA’s. The time has come, I believe, for more details. While I appreciate the sentiment in this post, it does nothing for me as a customer (if I am that) and CERTAINLY not as an investor (if I am that). I really believe that I have grace to give and would be understanding if Jolla would give me something to be gracious towards. But right now it is silence. No one answering any questions. Offering apologies for missing deadlines, but then not actually giving any resolution, potential or otherwise. Simply, a vague bar graph saying at some point in the next 3 months you will receive a tablet. I find that this leaves a pretty bitter taste in my mouth. Mr. Saarnio, please do not take us for fools. We understand that you do not have all of the answers, and that some of the answers you think you have might end up changing before the end. That’s alright. We get it. But as long as Jolla maintains a policy of silence there is going to be mutiny on the ship.
+1
Here it is the point of crowdfunding. You are an in-between an investor and a customer with no advantage but just inconveniences. As an investor your money (investment) is not garanteed, and as a customer, if the company is successful you get nothing in return.
Personaly I tried this crowdfunding for the first time and it will be the last.
When I see how a company can raise money and keep me in the dark for so many months, to me it is very much dishonnest. As I said in previous post, being late is not an issue to me as soon as I have real information on what is going on and what is the exact plan. Here I feel scammed.
You are right about the in-between status of backers. We are not investors: a real investor hopes that the company they are investing in will add value to the investment, and some of that value will be returned to the investor. Of course, the risk is that some or all of the investment might be lost. As backers, we know that we will not get our contribution back. The most that we can hope for is to get the perk that we signed up for, and the knowledge that if no-one had signed up for the campaign that the perk (or its equivalent) might not appear at all.
It is a personal matter whether this risk/reward balance is a reasonable one or not. For me, the main point is swimming against the tide of corporate surveillance, especially since Microsoft joined the data slurping party. I could have waited until hardware running SailfishOS was readily available and become a conventional customer that way, but I feel strongly enough about the issue to have decided to join the IGG campaign. People who have pre-ordered have a different status of course: they are more like customers.
Jolla’s communication is another matter of course, and IMHO shows a serious lack of judgment and/or a failure to understand the dynamics of their project. I don’t believe that there is any actual dishonesty involved though.
If all this makes me a fanboi or a white knight, then so be it. Whatever.
Having read all complaints, I feel like there’s no water left to navigate.
I have pre-ordered the tablet. Pre-Ordering means I will get the vessel when it is ready. The risk to buy a not yet ready vessel is mine.
Nevertheless, communication is a matter. Having to communicate about communication is a serious indication for things going wrong. While it seems jolla is feeling the pulse in respect of the OS (together, #sailfishos, …), it does not in respect of the hardware.
I suppose, that jolla phone and tablet where just a proof of demand for Sailfish OS driven items. So communication about hardware delivery is no subject, as long as selling Sailfish OS is the only focus.
Therefore, all that riot about delivery accents the demand for sailfish OS items.
Would I as a company trying to sell the OS would even try to calm it down? No, as all that riot simply is a big exclamation mark and statement.
“Look, we could sell a lot more of that kind of phones and tablet. The first batch was sold out in hours. There is a big demand for it. Invest in my business. Buy our OS, produce phones and tablets. And we guarantee you will earn a lot of money.”
Think:
Who are jolla’s customers?
We as users or other companies who produce phones and tablets?
Thats what they said so far. The devices are usecases to show whats possible with SFOS https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oI0aqx37pO0
Dear Jolla captain,
You have offered us null information.
You have had so many comments and still yo do not give any answer.
There are 2 options:
Jolla is Jolla as we think it was: you’d better step down for your attitude towards customers is perfectly suitable for Apple et al.
Jolla has turned into an Apple like corporation:
I will be very happy to end my customer relation with Jolla.
Some of the questions above have just been answered with a separate post: https://blog.jolla.com/tablet_faq/
Actually their follow up post added zero new details. They still did not tell us:
1) How many units were in the first “wave” they shipped in October,
2) How many units will be in the second “wave” they will ship later,
3) Why their communications have been so infrequent and utterly devoid of any useful information,
4) When pre-order tablets will actually ship.
So, sorry, it doesn’t actually answer any of the questions here. Not a single person here asked how to put in the SD card or change the volume while it was charging in the case.
Jolla: “ship as much as possible within wave 2”
That is planned begin November according to Jolla.
Jolla: “That said, unfortunately, it seems that the lion’s share of deliveries are aimed for shipment start in December.”
You stated that December is the third wave!
I am completely lost.
“People powered OS” – do you mean sth like the Maelzel Automaton? Or which people, doing what? “We at Jolla believe in transparency.” The transparency of what? “Proudly open” – indeed…
The IT press has had no comment on Jolla recently – Jolla’s problems go under the radar, or is it a feat of „proud openness” in the PR? A transparent “no statement” policy?
How can I cancel my Jolla tablet and get my money back. wait until December is an impertinence.
It looks like something odd is happening to the comment section of the blog; the comment counter at the top of the comments has increased in number, but the actual comments are starting to disappear (at least on my browser). I think everything posted after October 19th is now missing… Have we overloaded the system? 🙂
Drat, please ignore my previous comment. I clicked on the wrong blog entry, I thought I was reading the “FAQ” blog. (Feel free to delete this post and the previous one. Thanks!)
Hello, is there any news about the second batch?
The second shipping wave should start early November (start in ten days)?
Nope, no news yet.
Don’t you think you should offer a refund option before you ship the next batch?
Or at least say something?
I get my conformation email for the order on 29.10.2014 (so tomorrow it’s a year of waiting).
I thought i am on the second delivery wave, but i did not get an email to finish the order until yet.
It would be nice to get an information what the wave contain e.g. orders 800 to 2500 or orders received until 10th of Oct ..
But it seems that communicativeness is not distinct property of the jolla company ;-).
Hi Jolla,
This is my first comment since the beginning of the campaign.
I contributed on 19th november 2014 – with 64gb upgrade – can you let me know if i will recieve the tablet in November or december.
октябрь уже кончается а планшета так и нету=(
Нам русским “недочеловекам” наверное придётся вообще до февраля-марта хер дрочить, в лучшем случае
Two simple questions:
HAS THE SECOND WAVE STARTED: YES or NO?
HOW DO I KNOW THAT MY TABLETS ARE IN THAT WAVE?
1) The second wave won’t start until at least November. Given that it is not yet November, I think it’s safe to say no. 🙂
2) Jolla does not yet know how many tablets will be in the second wave, as they have stated explicitly above. Therefore, they cannot give you an answer as to whether your tablets will be part of it.
Well, it’s November 6 now. According to the statement the conformation communication (grey box) should have started end of October.
So, that is ANOTHER DELAY of at least 2-3 weeks without any notification.
I, and many others, are angry. The silence of Jolla is arrogant and insulting.
Google seems will pay $25 back because of 2 weeks delay of the nexus 6P.
Not the case with Jolla!
For me this tablet seems to be outdated and a refund would be the best option.
http://www.geek.com/android/nexus-6p-delay-leads-to-25-refunds-from-google-1638146/
As the last business day of October, YOU (Jolla) shall be in position to confirm the november delivery dates and to confirm the december planning. Are you?
They shall be in a position to confirm November delivery dates only assuming that no problems have occurred manufacturing tablets for November delivery. Unfortunately, given past history, that may be a poor assumption. In any case, as they have mentioned before, very very few tablets are expected for the November delivery anyway… Best not to get one’s hopes up.
Same here, I hope the roadmap gets more accurate?
As many on this blog, I am confused about the message early october. I was hoping to be at least in the november shippment, but as I haven’t heard anything from lolla, it seems I am not. At this point I don’t think jolla is a fair partner to me. They took my money and promised to ship in may. OK, there are circumstances that causes a delay. Right now it doubled the time. That isn’t a delay for some minor design changes.
I always prefer european products, but this time I am a little worried my money is gone.
Still alive… https://jolla.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/210322097-Jolla-Tablet-Invitations-and-Delivery-FAQ Yesterday there came a new line: “As of November 2015 we have not yet shipped all Tablets to all contributors” Any news is good news?!?
Having pre-ordered mine on 19 November last year, I’m beginning to wonder where my tablet is. Any thoughts?
To all, I got my refund today from this project, they deducted me IGG and Paypal fees. I found very unfair, Joint me on this one.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/778654475593332/
@federico1828, How did you manage to get your refund? I’m kind of thinking to do the same or to forget about this contribution.
I paid for this via Paypal and on the invoice you can see the name of person as well as the email address. He did not fully refund me, he discount more that 10%. This Jolla Asia Limited is in Hong Kong, for you guys to know.
It’s kinda too bad you couldn’t wait for the tablet itself to be delivered. I can just imagine what price this incredibly rare one-of-a-kind device is going to fetch on Ebay… 😉
Well there is no app for this Sailfish yet, and I have not see any reviews from any of the developers, that were supposedly working for the environment. Also the hardware is getting outdate and the prices of the tablets are falling.
Doesn’t really matter (even if the thing has flaws) — collector’s items are collector’s items because they are rare. Orphaned or prototype devices can go for high dollars simply because the buyer gets the bragging rights of having an object that almost nobody else in the world does.
Of course, if Jolla does eventually find a way to wrestle tablets out of the factory, the uniqueness of the tablet will drop. But at least right now, these things are as rare as unicorns. If one of the first wave recipients had chosen to sell their device instead of keep it, I have no doubt they’d have made much more than their money back…
I am an “Early Sailor”. I expect to get an email every day until my tablet ships. I will be back here tomorrow, Nov 6 2015, to check in and report whether I got an email.
As has been stated right above in this blog, most backers (even the “early sailors”) are now not predicted to receive a tablet until at least some time in December. The November “wave” is just for the handful of tablets they’d have been able to scrape together out of the factory in October (and it sounds like that’s gonna be a pitifully small number). So, I predict you’re not likely to get an invite e-mail for another 30 days or so…
Also there are three flavours of “Early Sailors”: $189 (1000 people), $199 (1000 people) and $204 (2000 people). So there is a huge difference 8-|
O Captain! My Captain!…I am loosing the faith…
Is the ship in the middle of some kind of Perfect Storm?
Actually, if you add up the endless device modifications (especially the fully-laminated display), logistics snafus, indifference from the factory (no willingness to shift timeslots around to accommodate Jolla), week-long Chinese holidays, and component shortages, I’d have to say yeah, Jolla has managed to steer itself into a fairly nasty nor’easter with this tablet… 😉
I can predict the next delay: christmas and subsequently New Year.
And, when is the Chinese New Year?
Alright, I do have to ask — could we please, please, please get some sort of update from Jolla here? Yet another deadline on yet another schedule has now been missed; the “second wave” is not shipping.
If the latest “Jolla tablet delivery roadmap” is no longer valid, could we at least get some mention of that fact somewhere? Thanks.
Completely agree. If Jolla are going to do something about their “we don’t think we have anything to say, so we’ll go completely dark” approach, the start of next week would be a good time to do it. It doesn’t have to be long, detailed or polished, but some indication of where things have got to and what is currently holding things up would be good.
Fully agree. No contact from Jolla re second wave which we were told by the Chairman would start in November.Sadly looks like another broken promise.
Yep, it’s getting annoying that the community has to wait for every piece of information. In return we get “well sometimes and somehow you will receive your tablet. trust us!” 🙁
Why? Or, do you want some antother fable? 😉
Hi Carole
Ang news from the helm? The way Jolla acts remind me Nokia at its glorious days (not a compliment).
Are you on Schedule?
Rgds
Eric
Hello,
I am an Indiegogo non-early backer (from Feb.), and a bit concerned by the lack of information, because I trend to stop checking info here and my fear is to be completely forgotten.
Is there a way to verify I’m still registered somehow somewhere?
Given what I read I understand I’ll probably get nothing this year, and this is a bit sad.
I was prepared to wait, but basically end of year family meetings are a great way to show this kind of devices, and burying it for a couple more months is a concern for both me and the Jolla future…
I also have a first-generation Fairphone, so I maintain a connection with this company, and I recently saw their next model (twice costlier than the tablet) will come along with a theoretical possibility of running Sailfish -I say theoretical because Fairphone seem to just open this possibility to third-parties with no other commitment on development or schedule).
Still this is a good thing IMHO -sort of minimally good.
Feeling very annoyed that I’ve had nothing but disappointment from the team at Jolla. You’ve alienated consumers by failing to have regular accurate timescales. When will I receive my tablet, if ever? I’m so annoyed for even wasting my money on this product, as I could have had an iPad for over a year if I had just gone down that route. Now I’ve just sat around waiting for false timelines. Be straight up with us, when will someone from Jolla realise that customer service isn’t one size fits all. You should give individual and personalised information, particularly around timeline for delivery.
### Ditching into November – any news / updates about the second wave ? ###
I was in that second wave, payed another 40 bucks for tax, was told shipment will start within 10 business days. That was on October 14th. After ten days I asked them what’s up and they said they have problems with their fulfillment center and they hope the issues will be resolved in the next weeks.
They missed the 10 days window they set for themselves and they didn’t even inform people about it.
I don’t know what people at Jolla are thinking.
Jesus Christ, Jolla, what is your problem? Just look at any decent crowdfunded project. Almost noone ever lives up to their promises concerning deadlines, but it DOES NOT make pledgers mad – because normally people behind such startups share their problems as soon as they arise. And backers know WHY the deadline slipped and patiently wait for the resolution.
WHY are you so afraid of telling your backers the truth?.. Seriously, there is NOTHING shameful in saying something like “sorry guys, those mofos from the factory changed our production schedule because our batch size is small”. Or something like “we totally dropped the ball with that-and-that and are doing that-and-that to sweep up the mess”. This is the standard behaviour in investor/startuper relationships. If you actually believe that such post will do not good but BAD to your PR then you have no idea how business works, sorry.
Perhaps Jolla to lay off all Sailors and the steersman is not in time for it. Does someone living close to Jolla HQ? The lights are still there? 🙂
I contributed on the 19th nov 2014… but have not received anything yet (I believe I should be in the first wave). I understand what I signed up to, and have no complaints in terms of delays etc. I would however like to get a full refund since it is unlikely I will see the tablet in 2015 judging by current developments (and history with the jolla phone). How can I go about doing this? Thanks!
Software is quite good, but because there’s no new hardware available I have to buy soon some other OS phone and that’s going to be end of using sailfish (unfortunately) phone. When funded in indiegogo i think that I have new tablet before christmas but I was wrong, now I don’t know have I ever Sailfish tablet. Is Jolla sinking?
+1
Yes, someone go & check please ! Maybe in HK as well … to get an idea. What’s the actual manpower of jolla ?
The captain still owes information about the jolla split-up since July and the future plans involved.
Maybe the Intex AquaFish venture struggles with technical challenges as just experienced with tablet – thus all manpower bound … but “shameful capitulation” is no excuse – as it can be interpreted as ignorant as well :/
@Carol Chen : How about a convincing, “full-bunny-powered” story about jolla’s restructuring and concepts involved ? Thank you indeed 🙂 (thumbs)
@Antti Saarnio : How about living up the actual implications involved to the Japanese bow just claimed above ? It comes with a promise of instant improvement in exchange for excuse – the soul of Kaizen …
In your case:
• improvement means clarity
• clarity means communications ( either by schedule compliance or good information if you can’t )
• communications means involvement
• involvement means trust & community-building
• community-building means advertisement
( = reasons for your business concept )
So, another month has passed. How’s the tablet wave forecast doing? Any swell rolling towards the coast of Finland any time soon? Or anywhere? How about that refund option you mentioned?
I have taken my mind off the whole mess, lack of communication and stuff. I thought I was one of the early birds, 22 sept but turns out that it doesn’t matter when. Just keeping my cool, waiting. One day it will come.
Jah bless.
Please be #unlike and post a project update, the lack of information around the tablet is very frustrating for sailors who have loyally backed your company from the conception of the phone, through the evolution of Sailfish to the ‘voyage’ of the tablet.
This sailor may soon be jumping in a lifeboat as I am no longer sure the destination will be reached.
Jolla IS the lifeboat, we have nowhere to jump (at least until Neo900 is finished)
Dear Captain, any news on the second wave?
We’re loosing credibility in your company and promises.
it is better to tell truth rather than keep contributors in dark.
i really appreciate on an update. Even if the project failed, is a better news than nothing.
Is there anyone going to Slush2015 meeting (http://www.slush.org/agenda/) Tomorrow mr. Saarnio is on the stage and the topic is: “Jolla: the impossible story continues, Jolla shares the next chapter in their journey.” Someone could ask about tablet…
Hi,
is there any way to check what estimated delivery for my tablet will be? I backed the tablet through the original IndieGoGo funding process.
Thanks
I contributed for the Jolla tablet (64GB) on March 3. When is the estimated shipping time for that contribution date? And do we get a notification mail when it will be shipped?
So far I haven’t had any mails about estimated shipping or delays. Most information I read was in these blogs. But that is not all that clear sometimes.
Thanks.
I have ordered my Jolla tablet on 8th December 2014! So can someone please tell me where my tablet now is? Already shipped or lost? No link or update found to see what is going on. I’am a little bit disappointed…. Thanks.
Me too, december 2014
Hi.
As this appears to be sinking, How do I get my money back.
As an early backer who added extra perks (the 64 mem)later, I feel robbed multiple times.
PS: I ‘d still prefer getting that tablet though.
What mostly annoys me is that Jolla asked for paying an extra perk AFTER their Indiegogo campaign was labeled as successful.
Sent my “investment” off last year, 11-19-14, to be exact.
Live and learn, altho I’m old enough to know better.
Meanwhile, I have bought a Samsung 9″ tablet, a used Kindle, a really cheap Fire ($69 including a 32G card) and a cheap Win tablet.
This by the way was my first and last Indiegogo experience.
I am looking forward to getting the tablet, just so I can console myself that I’m not a complete fool.
its December. have they started shipping?
has anyone received notice that their tablet is shipping?
End of 2015!!
Any news?
It s december 20th! come on, where is the tablet? no update, did you guys run away with the money or what? thanks
I am exactly in same mood of the former comments.I order my tablet through indiegogo site in march 2015. Despite delivery Schedule and many mails from me I still did not receive my tablet. Come on Sirs! 2 possibilities, delivery or refund please. abd above all courtesy to answer to the ones who early contributes
I have my receipt from Indiegogo dated 29 March 2015. Where is the tablet delivery promised for Dec. 2015?
Happy New Year …. I hope this new year will bring me this much-desired tablet. Already a year, specifically, thirteen months I expect my tablet. There are two possibilities, either I get my tablet, I’m getting my money I have already sent. I used google translation.
As a “First Sailor” backer (the perk was named as ‘Jolla Tablet for First Sailors’ on IndieGoGo) I’d like to know when I should be expecting my tablet to arrive…
My wife had ordered a tablet on 08/12/2014
I’d like to know when I should be expecting this tablet to arrive…
I’m wondering when will you start ship those tablets ? Did anyone got it jet ? Tnx for reply.